Logic Puzzle Forums "Checking" should have a time penalty. A STEEP one.
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#1
01-23-2014, 04:00 PM
 BillsBayou Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Location: New Orleans Posts: 77
"Checking" should have a time penalty. A STEEP one.

I just set a couple of records by using the "Check" button. I do this by guessing on the "Either/Or" clues. If a puzzle has a couple of these and I get the guess right, the puzzle just falls into place because at this point, it's just so easy. I've even set records when I get the guesses wrong.

I don't think this is right. "Check" should cost the user a large time penalty.

For example, let's have a puzzle of boys date girls have food and drinks:
"Of Ted and Alice, one had pizza and the other drank wine."

Let's set Ted to "Not Pizza." Click "Check" and the box doesn't change color. Then Alice must have had wine. Don't forget that Ted didn't date Alice and the couple who had pizza didn't have wine.

Repeat for any other "Of" clues or clues using "either".

If you get it wrong, sure, you take a time penalty for it, but not enough that you've set your ending time anywhere bad.

The key is to set the guess to "NOT". If you were to say "Ted IS pizza" and you're wrong, you suffer THREE time penalties. One for the wrong guess, and the other two because the entire Boy column and Food row are all gray when you click "Check". The upside is that you now know TWO true answers.

The "Check" button has no cost. I think it should have a very steep cost. Or maybe you only get one free "Check" and then the cost goes up for each time you click "Check".

One addition relates to the "Undo" button's capabilities. The "Undo" button seems to know when I've set something to "True" and sets all other values in the Row/Column to false. When the "Check" button finds a "True" error, it should "Undo" the "True". Thus wiping out all the Row/Column "False" values that were set automatically by the game. Any "False" values set by the user would remain and be evaluated by the "Check" feature. This would eliminate the two "True" that are given to the user by the current operation of "Check".

Maybe the program could use the "Undo" feature and roll back to the user's first error. Example: I play the game out and notice a contradiction. Because of an earlier error, the entire board is screwed. When I click "Check", the game rolls back to the earliest error and only charges me for that error (plus, of course, the use of "Check").

Last edited by BillsBayou; 01-23-2014 at 04:02 PM.
#2
01-24-2014, 03:53 AM
 sunrise Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 13

The check function takes time which costs you seconds no matter what.

If you achieve your high score by cheating, or not thinking, what was the point of doing the puzzle to begin with. This is like steroids and world records, you bring everything down.

I use the check function when I'm pretty sure that my "logic" was correct, just to double check. Some of the more obscure leaps suddenly pop out at me and I'm not sure why I "know" they're true (those of you more experienced probably find them easy). Anyway, there's nothing more embarrassing that hitting the check button 27 steps later and having half the board removed.
#3
01-24-2014, 06:54 AM
 plutoking Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2013 Posts: 1

Yeah, it's pretty demoralizing to get pretty far into a puzzle only to find out that one of your earlier steps was incorrect, thus negating all of your subsequent work. Checking prevents that from happening. Yes it probably allows some people to cheat, but who cares? I do these puzzles for fun. Besides, since there's so many puzzles, these records are relatively meaningless.
#4
01-24-2014, 09:13 AM
 Marelize Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2013 Posts: 1

Billbayou
I agree full-heartedly.
#5
01-24-2014, 11:14 AM
 Golden66 Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 1

Agree there should be a time penalty for checking.

Those who care about the score don't get cheated as easily, and players like plutoking who care more about the mental exercise aren't affected.
#6
03-01-2014, 03:07 PM
 JulieC Junior Member Join Date: Mar 2013 Posts: 24

I haven't been playing as much, did something change and then change back? When I have an error upon checking, I get hit with huge penalties, I think 120 seconds per mistake. When I have one mistake, I almost always have another, so a minimum of 240 seconds penalty. I use check a lot because I hate back tracking, but my times for puzzles I make a mistake in are generally 5-10 times as much as ones that I don't. I'm not guessing. I think the penalty is plenty steep enough.
#7
03-01-2014, 04:20 PM
 Sze770 Junior Member Join Date: Feb 2014 Posts: 1

yup this is very very true
i mean i use it a lot but still its like cheating
#8
03-02-2014, 11:21 AM
 yvmaxwell Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 8

How do u do a check unless it's a guess then clear errors?
#9
03-02-2014, 11:58 AM
 yvmaxwell Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 8

Never mind. Figured it out. Just that i've never used or looked at "answers". Always assumed they had all answers on it. So I agree there should be a penalty if your'e trying for points.
#10
03-03-2014, 06:44 AM
 Blab Junior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 10
What is the "Check" button?

I don't see a check button on any puzzles I do. There is a "clear errors" button, but that always has a steep penalty from what I've seen. What is meant by "checking"?

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